LED headlamps

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Roger King
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LED headlamps

Post by Roger King »

It's worth noting that the MOT rules changed regarding LED headlamps in January.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-inspect ... tion-4-4-3

I'd think carefully before fitting these! One government site was making similar noises about rear lighting, all due to the LEDs needing to comply with E rating requirements, which very few in current use do at present. I can't find the link but no doubt if that's the case it will be broadcast.
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peterc
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by peterc »

Hi Roger,
Yes, heard about this a few days ago and have already written to my MP.
Basically if Headlights with LED’s can pass an MOT when tested by a Ministry approved engineer using ministry approved equipment then what’s the problem. Either this part of the MOT is a waste of time or the proposed new rule is stupid and not needed.
I’ve checked the web site and currently the rear LED’s are OK but yes I appreciate the ongoing tide of changes that the Gov seem to dream up.
I started a post under general Cobra on the same subject.
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Roger King
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by Roger King »

I've just found the other reference I was looking for - it's in today's Classic Car Weekly. To quote:

'LEDs cannot be fitted anywhere else on historic vehicles, unless the LED bulbs you have fitted conform to (UN) ECE standard 128 as a component and (UN) ECE standard 148 when fitted. Very few bulbs on the market currently meet this standard, and are therefore illegal.'

A spokesperson for the TR Register is quoted as commenting: '...there are no regulations governing the use and output of LED bulbs, and in some cases can represent a downgrade compared to a filament bulb and [the] lens designed to work with it.'

I would certainly agree with the latter comment - I have seen several Cobra-style LED taillights which are poor at best, often with indicators behind reflector lens sections or with brake lights that, when applied, render the flashing indicator invisible in daylight. Even VW got this wrong with the lethal indicators on the old model of Jetta.
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peterc
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by peterc »

Thanks Roger I will pass that info onto Gil Keane of Better Car Lighting who I have been in contact with previously on this issue. Clearly the problem goes deeper than I first thought.
I would say that I am very pleased with my LED rear lights created by Spyida as they are significantly brighter than the standard coffin style Lucas even when fitted with a polished reflector. There is plenty of difference between rear light and brake light modes and the indicator does not affect the other two. I have taken the precaution of having separate reflectors as the indicator is positioned behind that section of red.
I agree that some very modern set ups leave a lot to be desired.
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clive
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by clive »

Roger King wrote: Wed Mar 10, 2021 6:29 pm

'LEDs cannot be fitted anywhere else on historic vehicles,
Are our vehicles historic?
Cheers, Clive.

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Roger King
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by Roger King »

Some are, some aren't - but the light units (assuming replica Cobra) weren't designed for LEDs. I think the point of the MOT update is that bulbs of the correct (UN) ECE standards must be used, in an appropriate housing. VOSA will understandably assume that a modern kit car will not have 'historic' light units fitted retrospectively, which is what happens to most kit Cobras - so their guidance is not directed to kit cars, but to the historics to which these light units belong. Possibly less of a problem for the historics as they don't need an MOT, but technically they are obviously still breaking the regs.
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clive
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by clive »

From a personal point of view, I have tried LED bulbs in several cars which were fitted with halogen H4 bulbs and I didn't think they were much better than the PIAA bulbs that are already fitted. The problem seems to be that the reflectors are designed to focus a single light source from the tungsten filament where as most replacement LED bulbs have a series of small light sources which scatter the light in an unfocussed pattern which can also cause dazzling to oncoming traffic. From a safety point of view, if you cant see well at night, slow down!
Cheers, Clive.

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Roger King
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by Roger King »

I think I'd agree with that, Clive.
I have tripod headlamps with H4 bulbs fitted. The beam's not focussed by modern standards, but on the rare occasions I drive the Cobra at night I drive to the conditions - it's what I grew up with, after all. It's being seen by others - i.e. the rear lamps - that I am much more concerned about, and have tried pretty much all variations of stop/tail indicator LED options that have been produced. Gil's were OK, but the connections were very fragile and I didn't find them bright enough. The early Spiyda design were also not bright enough: the current design are better, but having followed several Hawks fitted with them over long distances abroad etc. I have come to the conclusion that a really good, safe arrangement is not really possible within the L542 casing. The later Cobra arrangement of separate lamps is a much better option, or retaining the L542 but adding a separate, discreet amber indicator lamp at the rear. It's odd - many original cars did that in the day, it's what a friend with a beautiful Aston DB2/4 has done and probably what I will do on my XK140. If it's good enough for them, I may well do the same with the Cobra too.
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clive
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by clive »

I suppose back in the day, some cars were still using semaphore-arm indicators and if I remember correctly, my Grandfather's Standard 10 pick-up didn't have indicators at all. I'm not sure when they became compulsory, but as the traffic was so light then they weren't essential.
Cheers, Clive.

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Roger King
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Re: LED headlamps

Post by Roger King »

One of my friends has done all the RACMSA Euroclassic tours that I've done since 1993, covering an average of around 3000 miles each year on these alone in his 1950 Rover Cyclops. This has all the original lighting, including semaphore indicators only. It doesn't seem to give him any problems.
And anyway, most modern drivers seem to think they're optional anyway.
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